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Moderators: Jim Murray, narcosis, felixcatuk, Sammy
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| EtherDreams |
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 Registered Member #185 Joined: Fri Mar 14 2008, 09:27PMPosts: 114 | The web analytics industry, including Hitwise, is about much more than just ranking sites according to popularity. For example: http://www.hitwise.co.uk/products-services/product-features.php To accomplish what they are doing, they must track people across and within websites, perform some profiling, link in demographic data, etc. Experian and Hitwise are now one, and there are some interesting opportunities for data appending in both directions. I think the Hitwise Lifestyle product is one example. I'm not sure but I think this dark unbelly of the net first saw some real light in response to a talk given by David Cancel of Compete.com. Although that was a US context, I think the same may apply in the UK: http://wanderingstan.com/2007-03-19/is_comcast_selling_your_clickstream_audio_transcript To address the privacy issues posed by analytics and targeted advertising, I think at least two things need to be focused on: 1) Unique identifiers, be they IP Addresses or arbitrarily assigned UIDs or usernames or whatever. It is far too easy to link those to specific individuals, and they are what allows data and activity to be linked over time. 2) URIs, as they frequently contain personally identifiable information or other sensitive data, reveal exactly where users are going and by extension what they are reading/doing, and there is absolutely no way to reliably sanitize them. In both the ISP based analytics and ISP based targeted advertising scenarios, the ISP is sharing information that is tagged with unique identifiers and sharing URIs. For secondary purposes mind you. It is not the inherent sharing that takes place as part of normal network operations, it is not fundamental to the operation of an ISP. | ||
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| madslug |
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  Registered Member #266 Joined: Tue Apr 01 2008, 12:11PMPosts: 497 | MMMmmmmmmmm Bring on the legislation that works AND protects. First the concept of ethics in all online marketing. Slavery is still legal in some countries but looks like it is being legalised by stealth elsewhere too. I am a free (wo)man - DO NOT WANT. Proud to be a Phorm free ISP - www.mADSLax.co.uk - Griffin reseller | ||
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| EtherDreams |
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| Registered Member #185 Joined: Fri Mar 14 2008, 09:27PMPosts: 114 | Oh, way to go madslug! Do you have any idea how many core dumps you just caused by posting a suggestion that there could be ethics in online marketing? | ||
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| felixcatuk |
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felixcatuk  Registered Member #95 Joined: Wed Mar 05 2008, 12:03AMPosts: 1097 | I've been following up on Hitwise while there's a lull in the Phorm battle. From what I can see, they are little better than Phorm. They use interception to gather data from [transparent?] proxy servers, but make money by flogging the 'anonymous' intelligence directly to third parties. Does anyone know which of the UK ISPs are doing this? I can see another Police complaint following hard on the heels of Phorm. Hard to imagine any web site consenting to their traffic being intercepted in this way, and I don't recall any consumer facing 'opt in'. [ Edited Fri Aug 22 2008, 02:23PM ] BT/Virgin/TalkTalk customers - you don't need Webwise and Phorm, pure and simple. Regulators will not protect you from Phorm. Find a Phorm Free ISP. Protect your privacy. Protect your web content. Phorm must be stopped. www.Dephormation.org.uk: Free Anti-Phorm Countermeasures for Firefox Users and Web Sites Sign the No. 10 Downing Street Petition PhormUKPRTeam/PhormUKTechTeam is a PR consultant from Citigate Dewe Rogerson. | ||
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| O2 |
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| Registered Member #381 Joined: Wed Apr 30 2008, 08:16AMPosts: 67 | I've also been on the heals of hitwise and AKAICT there is a subtle difference. They don't seem to look at the content of pages visited, and therefore could claim not to fall under RIPA. They will of course come under PECR, which clearly states that traffic information must only be used with the clear and unambiguaous consent of the users. ONe of the major confusions is over what is and is not traffic data. Experts on ukcrypto seem to be saying, AFAICT, that whilst an IP address is traffic data, a URL is NOT because the ISP doesn't need to look at a URL in order to route the communications. However, I have heard a counter-argument that centres around the fact that ordinary web pages do not constitute communications in the traditional sense. Phorm get into trouble because it is clearly technically not possible to pre-filter all mail and private comms from an IP stream, but hitwise could argue they don't go near comms. So a totally grey area, or at least a lot greyer than Phorm and RIPA. Obviously I expect even BT/Phorm to get off the hook at first because of icompetence and lack of understanding of the technology, but in the end any court surely must agree with the Fipr argument over RIPA and Phorm (fingers crossed)! | ||
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